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  1. #21
    Senior Member
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    Rolf Wittwer
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    Erratic idle - Injectors

    Yesterday my bike was running beautifully. I decided I need more weight to stop the front wheel lifting when I nail it, so I rode to Snowtown for an Indian takeaway. I returned via the short cut over 27 km of dirt road, some of which was badly pot-holed. Not only did one of my rear indicators snap off from the jarring, the stalling returned! The engine conked-out three times when I slowed for intersections and nasty bits. The rough road is probably not the cause but the fact I dropped the idle speed yesterday. The idle has been very variable, which combined with a tall first gear, can be a nuisance when I need to ride slowly. After Trevor's hint on this thread in his 19/11 post I read Engenia's page and some threads about the injectors. I can see I have been trying to reinvent the wheel as a late-comer to this forum. I'm thinking I might bite the bullet and get a set of the Denso injectors. First I must unravel all the threads and work-out what is required. Anyone know about these? 30lb 315cc Benelli TNT 1130 12-Hole Fuel Injector Upgrade Brand New | eBay

  2. #22
    Senior Member Trevor68's Avatar
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    If the injectors improve low rpm throttle response count me in for a set! Even after the dyno run the trek still hesitates when snapped on hard under 4K, and runs rough around 3-4K, not to mention is still bloody thirsty, only 230K from last tank, taking 18L to fill.

    Idle has always been good on mine, if somewhat high at 1600rpm, though the other day it decided to idle just fine at 1000rpm for awhile, then went back to it's normal 1600. I had pretty much just decided it has no manners around town and is a all or nothing kind of ride.

  3. #23
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    Whoa, 7.8L/100km sounds excessive! Perhaps I can't compare because most of my riding is country cruising at legal speeds but I average 6.5L/100km and lately have been using under 6L/100km. I have exceeded 7 only when the tank has included a traffic jamb or some running on the stand. If I snap the throttle wide open from idle in first gear we depart like a scalded cat and the front wheel gets very light. It sounds like either your bike has a fault or your map is not right. Mine normally idles at around 1400 rpm and lately has not stalled except when I dropped the idle to 1200 rpm. Since then I put it back to 1350-ish and it has not stalled again. While low speed running on the road seems pretty good the idle is rich, smelly and the speed is erratic. The posts in this forum on the subject make me optimistic that a change of injectors could fix that. I would rather avoid the expense and inconvenience of a dyno remap. The latest thread at https://www.benelliforum.com/forum/tn...injectors.html states that Maniac Motors can supply better injectors and a suitable map but I did not find anything pertinent on the Maniac Motors website. However the 12 hole injector option from Dimar Motor Sports interests me because it stands to reason that these should give better atomised fuel that will burn faster and more completely. I will continue to procrastinate in the hope I learn more before committing funds.

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  5. #24
    Senior Member Trevor68's Avatar
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    Your better off to simply email maniac and ask about what you want, they respond quite quickly.

  6. #25
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    It looks like under AU$500 including delivery for the Tills injectors and MM map. Alex reckons I can get away without a dyno tune if I don't insist in wringing-out the very last kilowatt. That makes it an economical solution. I am teetering on the edge of a commitment. Can anyone report the difference it has made to the fuel consumption or tank range on a TREK or TNT?

  7. #26
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    Could not make TREK misbehave on a 44 degree day.

    I did not commit to different injectors because Alex (Maniac Motors) explained that the Tills injectors and MM map will certainly make the bike run smoother but I can not expect more fuel range than I am getting now because the engine design needs a richish mixture for cooling and smooth running. I persevered adjusting my map at low revs and small throttle openings using the Lambda feedback as a guide. The engine now idles well and has not stalled for weeks. Yesterday I took the opportunity to try and make it misbehave when the ambient air temperature was 44 degrees Celsius. After the 6km ride into town at highway speed, to get it to normal operating temperature, I let it idle, which it did without faltering. Then I plodded around as slow as it would go. It behaved almost perfectly. The only criticism I could make is slight misfiring with the throttle just off the stop when decelerating or running down-hill. However under load it did not miss a beat. It seemed like a different bike to the one that played-up horribly in a traffic jamb on Westgate Bridge during warm weather last year. Perhaps the low speed gremlins are beaten. It still runs rich at high revs and wide throttle. While that has not been a problem for me, I intend to fit a gutted cat pipe Trevor68 sold me and load a map with Trevor68's leaner top half spliced to my bottom half, to see how that works. I will tackle it once the weather becomes more conducive to work in the garage.

  8. #27
    Senior Member Trevor68's Avatar
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    Sounds like a plan, let us know how you get on with the decat. Mine is not liking the heat much, keeps wanting to idle at 2500rpm which makes it frustrating to ride.

  9. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redbaron57 View Post
    I did not commit to different injectors because Alex (Maniac Motors) explained that the Tills injectors and MM map will certainly make the bike run smoother but I can not expect more fuel range than I am getting now because the engine design needs a richish mixture for cooling and smooth running. I persevered adjusting my map at low revs and small throttle openings using the Lambda feedback as a guide. The engine now idles well and has not stalled for weeks. Yesterday I took the opportunity to try and make it misbehave when the ambient air temperature was 44 degrees Celsius. After the 6km ride into town at highway speed, to get it to normal operating temperature, I let it idle, which it did without faltering. Then I plodded around as slow as it would go. It behaved almost perfectly. The only criticism I could make is slight misfiring with the throttle just off the stop when decelerating or running down-hill. However under load it did not miss a beat. It seemed like a different bike to the one that played-up horribly in a traffic jamb on Westgate Bridge during warm weather last year. Perhaps the low speed gremlins are beaten. It still runs rich at high revs and wide throttle. While that has not been a problem for me, I intend to fit a gutted cat pipe Trevor68 sold me and load a map with Trevor68's leaner top half spliced to my bottom half, to see how that works. I will tackle it once the weather becomes more conducive to work in the garage.
    Hi, I have been trying to get my Trek going using a lot of advice from the forum. I installed the twelve hole injectors which improved running at hi revs but the bike still stalled and ran rough at 2500-3500 revs. I next installed the 401 map which made the bike run much better but was still rough at 2500-3500 revs with a lower idle. Bike stalled going down hill through downshift which locked rear tyre. I then changed CO to 1.5. Bike started first fire, idled smoothly and ran perfectly - for 400 metres. It then started misfiring and the trip and odometer reset to 000000 and the injector light came on. I wheeled it home and disconnected the battery for 24 hours and got the trip and odometer working and got it started. But I now can't get tuneecu to connect. Any suggestions? I have also purchased some Brisk plugs as my last resort.

    Sent from my MIX 2 using Tapatalk

  10. #29
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    Crickey Peter! I have not experienced anything quite like that. Sounds like a bad electrical connection somewhere. The only time I had crazy electrical phenomenon was when I neglected to properly attach the earth terminals, one on the head and one down by the starter. After some crazy behaviour and an injector light that I ignored till I got home, it resulted in me frying my ECU. After I tightened the earth terminals it ran OK but would not switch off. In your situation I would be thinking about the things I have touched since it ran properly and checking all connections where I was working. Hope you find a problem without ECU damage. If Tune ECU will not connect it is likely a low voltage problem - again possibly a poor connection somewhere causing a voltage drop.

    P.S. Those injectors would have different characteristics to the original. To get the best out of them you would need a remap, which means a dyno tune or Power Commander with AutoTune. However I don't see that as related to your weird electrical phenomenon.
    Last edited by Redbaron57; 04-27-2018 at 10:19 PM.

  11. #30
    Senior Member Engenia's Avatar
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    Errol Kowald
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterM View Post
    Bike started first fire, idled smoothly and ran perfectly - for 400 metres. It then started misfiring and the trip and odometer reset to 000000 and the injector light came on. I wheeled it home and disconnected the battery for 24 hours and got the trip and odometer working and got it started. But I now can't get tuneecu to connect. Any suggestions?
    • Look for a possible vacuum leak. If fuel has sealed it the engine will run properly. When the fuel is drawn away the leak starts, leaning out the mixture and creating a misfire. It'll be "spitting back" through the throttle bodies.
    • When your trip reset the battery voltage will have dropped below that required to hold it up. I don't know the circumstances around that loss. You need to find out why it happened. The injector light came on for a reason. TuneECU / Axone could tell you what it was. That would be worth knowing.
    • To get TuneECU running again, there is a procedure someone came up with on here a number of years ago. I think I copied it and it's on my HDD somewhere. Alternatively, hook up an Axone. It will communicate and solve the problem TuneECU is having.
    hooroo, Errol www.engenia.com.au [136,351 km - and counting .....]

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