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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Back from her latest trip up the M1... did snake pass on the way back, seemed great, thru nasty traffic in Sheffield, no probs. Throttle off to turn into my road, stalls. Since then its as bad as ever. Can pretty much guarantee a stall or backfire on about 1 out of 5 times letting off the throttle I reckon. Only a matter of time before it stalls mid roundabout!
Quick straw poll, how many people with a tre, le or rs have this problem? I have the latest map etc, which seems to cure it for some, so interested to see how many people are putting up with it and whats fixed it for people before I decide what to do.
One question for those in the know about the electrics - there was a strange noise coming from under the seat the other day, like a continuous tone. At first I thought it was the ECU, but a bit of prodding led me to the line of rectifiers (at least thats what I think they are) under the seat. Removed the offending one and refitted it and its shut up now, but I just wondered if this could be related to the stalling? Its the second one from the right, if that means anything.

Lord knows I love the b1tch but she's trying my patience now :mad:

Col
 

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Relays

HI, they are relays under the seat, one relay is the injection relay that feeds the ecu and maintains a supply after you turn off so the ecu can complete its buisiness. You could look at the relays and if they are the same you could try swapping.Only prob is you may put fault to something else, The workshop manual has wiring diag and they look the same on that, but the writing is in italian so i cant tell what each one is. there are 7 shown.
One little thing that may cause stall etc is the pressure pipe that goes from the ecu to the air box. if you lift the tank a bit you can check to see it is on its litle stub on the right rear side of the bottom of the air box ? The ecu modifiys the air intake acording to the barometric pressure by adjusting the stepper (idle control valve) so if it fell off it may cause your fault.
Dont give in theres always a reason ! (ITS JUST FINDING IT THATS THE PROBLEM):doh: ;)
 

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Hi Borat,

My first TRE only stalled once in the 18 month that I had it. My current TRE used to do it all the time but I had the tick-over increased from 1100rpm to around 1300rpm when it was in for it's last service and this seems to have helped a lot.

A few of the guys on the Forum have had their tick-over increased to 1500rpm which has helped prevent the stalling but this may reduce the amount of 'engine braking' thats available a tad.

Other have suggested not pulling in the clutch lever until the revs drop below 2800rpm.
 

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Stalling Part 2

My RS does not stall,(1350rpm idle) but if stalling is a problem there are a few things to consider. 1) When a new map is installed etc, the throttle position sensor should be checked that is on "0" when shut and reset if required. 2) The stepper setting should then be checked that it is on 30-40 on idle (tre900) .
3) Now when the co (carbon monoxide) is set (1-3 %) 1% = veggies 3% = meat eaters (IUSWIM) then the stepper must be rechecked that it is within the limits still. If not, it can be adjusted back correct. If it is low it may be that the injector body valves are set open more than they should be. If they are set right the stepper will be correct. The stepper position is important.
Obviously the bodies should be balanced before above! All of this is part of the normal maintainance procedure and is in the manuals if you want a read up. There could be faults on the tps or a sticky stepper etc... that would also cause stalling etc...... then again if everything was perfect we would only get bored !;)
 

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Borat,

My first Tre, which was brought back in 2003 (...and these whipper snappers complain about depreciation today :bawl: ...), stalled almost all the time. And I mean almost all the time - every time I slowed to a stop it would cough, and on the majority of occasions would then stall. It was in and out of 3X many times, and on one notable occasion after being "fixed" it stalled twice before I got the 100yds from their premises to the end of the road on the industrial estate (by the burger van for those who know 3X). Their after sales team learnt a few new words that day during a rant about road testing bikes before returning to customers :D .

When it hit the first winter (I had picked it up in September) I left it with them for two months to basically rip to pieces and swap part-for-part one at a time with one of their demonstrator bikes. I spent quite a bit of time on the phone with Ricky Ross (who worked for them at the time) getting updates and mulling possibilities, but in the end after swapping almost everything except the engine they admitted defeat. I agreed a straight swap for a new replacement Tre that I picked up almost 6 months to the day after picking up my first one. I was also offered an ex-demonstrator LE if I was prepared to stump up another £3K, but decided against it (too many dreams of splintering carbon fibre and horrendous post track day repair bills :eek: )

The latest bike has the occasional moment when it will stall, but this is very rare. I believe they were going to ship my original bike back to Italy for investigation, but I don't know if this happened.

3X did get my original bike back out later in the summer of 2004 as a demonstrator, so they / Benelli must have tracked down and fixed the problem eventually. So it looks like it is a fixable problem even in an extreme case like my first Tre.

Good luck !!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for all the advice. Its good to hear that there are some out there which don't do it. I know mine has given Russ nightmares already as the last time it was in it felt like there was something mechanical wrong (eg clutch) and it turned out to be the stepper.
Will speak to Russ and see what he suggests.

Cheers

Col
 

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Borat,

When it hit the first winter (I had picked it up in September) I left it with them for two months to basically rip to pieces and swap part-for-part one at a time with one of their demonstrator bikes. I spent quite a bit of time on the phone with Ricky Ross (who worked for them at the time) getting updates and mulling possibilities, but in the end after swapping almost everything except the engine they admitted defeat.

Bath, so it's your fault is it?

When I removed my tank to change my plugs a couple of months ago, can you imagine my horror when I took the tank off to find a different registration number and a surname written on the air box cover in indelible ink - my bike was supposed to be brand new and plated as such with a '05 plate!!!!!!
 

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We've discussed this cutting-out problem many times over the past couple of years, even Benelli Tech Dept couldn't help me with it (bloody wankers).

I still think one thing to consider is a stray spark that floats from cylinder to cylinder, if you run the bike with the airbox off you will see, when the engine trys to stall, a spit back up one of the intake tracks, evident by flame around one of the butterflies, this is random to each cylinder.

Another thing that can cause it is a momentary lean charge, maybe an airated fuel supply to the injectors? Ever just cracked the throttle on a big 4 stroke single only to hear a tuh through the carb as the engine cuts out? Similar thing me thinks.

We suspected originally that the air temperature sensor in the airbox could be getting warm from the engine and leaning the mixture causing a spit-back up the intake. It is usually found that the stutter happens under 3000rpm, over that the intake inertia over-powers the spit-back up the intake port.

Increasing the idle will reduce it, try not pulling the clutch lever in until you have to, this way the rear wheel will keep the engine turning and running.

Good luck boys, I work for a Kawasaki dealer now, not much more I can do.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
We've discussed this cutting-out problem many times over the past couple of years, even Benelli Tech Dept couldn't help me with it (bloody wankers).

I still think one thing to consider is a stray spark that floats from cylinder to cylinder, if you run the bike with the airbox off you will see, when the engine trys to stall, a spit back up one of the intake tracks, evident by flame around one of the butterflies, this is random to each cylinder.

Another thing that can cause it is a momentary lean charge, maybe an airated fuel supply to the injectors? Ever just cracked the throttle on a big 4 stroke single only to hear a tuh through the carb as the engine cuts out? Similar thing me thinks.

We suspected originally that the air temperature sensor in the airbox could be getting warm from the engine and leaning the mixture causing a spit-back up the intake. It is usually found that the stutter happens under 3000rpm, over that the intake inertia over-powers the spit-back up the intake port.

Increasing the idle will reduce it, try not pulling the clutch lever in until you have to, this way the rear wheel will keep the engine turning and running.

Good luck boys, I work for a Kawasaki dealer now, not much more I can do.
Hmm thats not too encouraging! I am well versed in the avoidance riding technique now, but it doesnt prevent it all the time, and my view is that we shouldnt have to put up with a fault like this. Upping the idle is only masking the problem. The fact that there are bikes out there that don't do it and some that do it a lot less frequently makes me less willing to make do than if it was every single bike. I always knew Benelli ownership would mean putting up with a couple of niggles and I am fine with putting up with the clock resets, neutral etc. When it comes to something as fundamental as this though I don't think its right that I have to live with it. If we don't take Benelli to task on these things under warranty, its no wonder prices stay low. Theres no way I would buy one out of warranty knowing what I know now. If Benelli want their image to improve, they have to start acknowledging these things exist and find a cure.

Anyway, rant over and it makes me glad I bought mine from Bennetts, as I know if it can be fixed, Russ will find a way!

Col
 

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Before April this year my 2005 Tre never cut out and had the original fuel map installed.
When Rusty serviced it this April, on the way home it stalled at a roundabout and did it a couple of other times in the month or two afterwards.
Since then I have done 1500-2000 mls since and its not stalled once !!! ??

I think it is pointless trying to understand the foibles that come with owning a Nelli !! :ele:
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Before April this year my 2005 Tre never cut out and had the original fuel map installed.
When Rusty serviced it this April, on the way home it stalled at a roundabout and did it a couple of other times in the month or two afterwards.
Since then I have done 1500-2000 mls since and its not stalled once !!! ??

I think it is pointless trying to understand the foibles that come with owning a Nelli !! :ele:
If mine was as intermittent as that I would agree. Imagine it was doing it at most roundabouts, unless you adjust your riding to try and avoid it. Would you still be prepared to live with it?
Interesting the behaviour you describe though, as mine hasnt been consistent. When I first got it, it was stalling and lumpy and kicked out oily smoke.
Went in and had stem seals done and mapping tweaked. Didnt stall, didnt smoke, but was blowing back on the overun.
In again, had stepper replaced, runs like a dream mainly, but now stalling has come back.

Makes it very difficult to repair, as Russ obviously tested it each time before giving it back and it didnt stall.

Next plan is its going back with Russ in the van when hes down my way for the bike show. So next update towards the end of the year ;)

Col
 

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For sure Benelli's have had their fair share of teething troubles, even the injection of Chinese money still hasn't seemed to be able to fix anything yet but my 2006 GSXR1000 sometimes stops when I pull up at lights, grrrr, reminds of my Benelli days, lol
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Too many electrics I reckon... Strip em all out, bolt in an old 2 stroke engine and jobs a good'un :rolling:

Col
 

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Bath, so it's your fault is it?

When I removed my tank to change my plugs a couple of months ago, can you imagine my horror when I took the tank off to find a different registration number and a surname written on the air box cover in indelible ink - my bike was supposed to be brand new and plated and as such with a '05 plate!!!!!!
;) TotnadoTRE - mine once came back from a service with another bikes belly pan on it. As my original had scrapes from not leaning off enough round corners (which is how I spotted the switch) I didn't shout about it... I was also given a new side panel after a different service as someone in the workshop stood on my original...

Don't suppose the registration number on your air box has a JJ* or EE* in it ?
 

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;) Don't suppose the registration number on your air box has a JJ* or EE* in it ?
To be honest I can't remember now, I guess I should have written it down and enquired about it here!

I'll get the lads at Red Dog/Bennetts to have a nose for me when it is in for the big service, but that probably won't be until the spring now as there is no point getting it done now - the bike won't get much use from now until then!
 

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No stalling for me

My 2003 Tornado TRE has never been blighted with the stalling problem, did I mention I was selling it - I'm sure I did.... :D
 
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